Maybe somebody’s asked this already but how come, in this day and age, there isn’t a way to snapshot your entire phone into some sort of encrypted blob for storage in a location of your choice? You could wipe your phone and setup a throwaway profile with some basic apps before traveling, and then restore the snapshot once safely through customs.
Border issues aside, it would be very handy to be able to snapshot a phone like that anyway…
What you’re talking about is basically an encrypted backup. Seedvault does exactly that, it’s included in many custom ROMs, including GrapheneOS.
O rly? I will look into this, thanks!
There isn’t such a feature on android because they can’t scan your stuff for advertising if it is an encrypted blob. Apple let’s you do this with an iphone, iirc.
Why would you not just take a secondary (read: wiped) phone going somewhere problematic instead of relying on features like this? You know US border security under Trump plays fast and loose with your rights.
Because burner phones have bad cameras.
I hope he sues the agent for wiping his data.
Guys don’t travel to fascist countries.
So only girls go to fascist countries?
I believe the proper coordinate term is “gals”. Ie. “Only gals travel to fascist countries”. You’ll get a B-
Yes only gals
Idr if this was a feature that made it into a real OS or just a concept that never came to be, but…
I recall reading about a duress pin that instead of deleting stuff, just booted up normally… but to basically a separate user profile. From the non-duress profile you could choose features that would be shared between the two, like texts or call history of specific people, browser history, photo albums, etc.
So “sure officer, it’s 5224” would open up a phone profile that looks convincingly used, with nice long trails of cat memes and chatter with your gaming buddies about your favorite franchise enshittifying, and so on.
Punch in your real pin to unlock it though, and it’s got full access to everything, including data you want to keep private.
…and, uh, if any of you are designing a mobile OS right now, here’s your feature suggestion!
So basically veracrypt hidden volumes
Was there ever a revelation about truecrypt and why it suddenly shutdown?
Prosecuted for what, exactly? If push comes to shove, it’s a fifth amendment issue.
I would wager that this is going to become a test case that is intended to appeal it’s way to the SCotUS. The SCotUS has already ruled that many constitutional protections are waived at the border, so it wouldn’t be surprising if that is the intended outcome.
Land of the Free™
Prosecuted for what, exactly?
For not being nice to the gestapo?
The charge treats the alleged wipe as destruction of property intended to prevent a government seizure.
He is being charged with destroying “evidence” but he was never charged with anything in the first place. That is like saying deleting any files at home is a crime. I’d think forcing you to present evidence necessary to charge you with something would fall under the constitutional right against self-incrimination.
Unfortunately according to the federal government you automatically consent to limited 4th amendment protections when you choose to fly. Domestic flights have more legal protections, but international flights basically wave your right to privacy.
They are allowed to ask for your phone’s password and do a “non-forensic” search of your phone for just about any reason. A more extensive “forensic” search where they plug your phone into another device can be made if they present reasonable suspicion. If you refuse a search they can hold onto your phone for several weeks.
The smarter move would have been to just refuse to give the password and trust that they wont want to go through the hassle of cracking your phone once it’s in custody.
Basically the only real way to protect yourself is to not keep any incriminating information on your phone. The courts have ruled that these searches only extend to data that can be physically accessed on your device and things like social media and cloud storage are not subject to the search. So it’s just best to save everything on the cloud and then restore it once you are done traveling.
Like resisting arrest when there’s no legal reason you were being detained or arrested?
Write the duress PIN on a piece of paper in your wallet. Someone searching your phone is probably also searching your wallet and may try the PIN.
Genius. Flips the script. In the process of conducting an illegal search, you deleted my phone causing considerable financial and emotional damage. Lawsuit time.
Legally this might be the same as intentionally deleting evidence. Rigging up evidence to be destroyed could be considered as intent of evidence misconduct, and some judges might not consider there to be a semantic difference given the intended end result to be the same (IANAL but the US judges are crazy)
It probably won’t work, at least (US)domestically. The requirement for obtaining a warrant before searching a phone is part of training because there is a clear Supreme Court ruling to that effect.
That being said, what the law says and what some random asshole does during a stop are not always the same thing.
Their way around it is they say that the border crossing technically isn’t 100% normal US territory and therefore some constitutional rights are suspended under the concept of “sovereign self-protection”. You could then say any law in the US could be used to justify this concept, in fact it was used to forcibly intern thousands of Japanese and Japanese-Americans during ww2.
He was targeted for purely political reasons, the cop-city environmental protest in Atlanta GA, and I’m wondering why the border officials were even aware of them. Is there some sort of “we don’t like what you think” list run by the gov?
His device was threatened with seizure even though he posed no threat, no visible threat or spoken one, no suspicion of a crime, and they had no idea what the contents were. His 5th Amendment rights were violated by the threat to seize it. They want to establish a precedent, that the very existence of a possibility of criminal contents, regardless of any reason to suspect any, is sufficient for search and seizure. Based on this a little kid deleting the contents of their ipad would be a crime.
In addition, how can you show intent to destroy evidence when you have no expectation of being detained or charged on any specific occasion, and have no idea what evidence they might be seeking?
Is there some sort of “we don’t like what you think” list run by the gov?
i’ve been on it, yes.
Is there some sort of “we don’t like what you think” list run by the gov?
You think all these data centers are just for making bad code and creepy videos?
They’re massive AI-powered false-positive factories.
This was a point of entry. No search warrant required.
They will 100% tell you they don’t need a warrant if it’s during any kind of traffic stop or border crossing.
Feds following the law? Did you miss the last decade?
That being said, what the law says and what some random asshole does during a stop are not always the same thing.
I’m half-expecting for it to turn out that he was being wholly compliant, and he’s being accused of destruction of evidence because they were looking for something that never existed to begin with.
The headline is wrong.
Fascist regime fucks over people’s constitutional rights and could send a man to prison for protecting his own privacy.
There, fixed.
If the duress pin makes obvious it’s the duress pin then it’s not really doing its job. It should instead open a profile with not much in it while erasing the other profile and files in the background.
They asked to unlock his phone, he entered the wipe instead personal pin, and the wipe starts, with no possible reversal.
I mean yeah they discover it when he hands them the phone and it shows something other than an unlocked screen… But he is still in detention? Making a fake homescreen will fool them for like 30 secs tops until they open literally any app and sees it’s either completely empty or that it doesn’t work.
What would that solve? It just drags out the procedure
The purpose of a duress code is plausible deniability.
There is an encryption product for Windows called VeraCrypt (aka TrueCrypt). You can create a hidden decoy volume inside an outer encrypted volume which has all your stuff in it. When mounted an observer cannot tell the difference between the hidden volume and the real volume since they are mounted the same way with different passcodes. You can put files in the decoy for plausibility but not the things you actually want to hide.
The same should be true of a duress code in a phone. It should be possible to put files, apps and stuff in the decoy that show activity e.g. email, pictures etc. Providing the other profile is wiped while this screen is showing then there is no immediate way of proving it was a duress code.
It would have to at least convince the border guard, but it should withstand forensic analysis too. So it might be necessary to do what VeraCrypt does.
On the Linux box I travel with, my main account is not shown on the list of user accounts when you login. There is a dummy account on the list. When I log into that, it has a full complement of apps and data, and the online email account it connects to is a secondary account I use for travel bookings, random notifications and other throwaway purposes. Financial data, important passwords, personal correspondence, etc, are not on that account. Just the usual stuff a non-computer-savvy guy my age would have: browsing, email and Facebook. If they ever comment on it being Linux, I’ll just say “my son set it up for me, I kept having problems with Windows.” But so far, the most they’ve ever done is ask me to show that the laptop can boot up. There’s also full-disk encryption so scans won’t tell them anything worth knowing.
The passwords I use are high-entropy. There’s no duress PIN, though I could set one up if so inclined. So far, I haven’t felt the need to.
I do this, too.
Definitely worth it.
Damn dog that’s a super smart setup, imma do the same thing to my travel laptop. Thanks for the suggestion ✊
"The duress PIN doesn’t give you a second chance and will trigger anywhere you enter it: on the lockscreen, while enabling Developer options, or even while unlocking an app that requests authentication. And unlike a regular factory reset, a duress PIN will erase all encryption keys and your phone’s eSIM partition as well. This makes it impossible for an attacker to access my data just by having physical possession of your device and knowledge of the PIN.
I think the real strength of GrapheneOS’ duress PIN lies in its subtlety. There are no confirmation prompts, no announcements, and no obvious signs that the wipe was intentional on your part. Of course, GrapheneOS is no longer a fringe operating system these days — it has even attracted the ire of law enforcement in some jurisdictions. In other words, a professional attacker might be aware of the existence of a duress PIN. But if you can enter it quickly enough, it achieves its intended effect: no data can be lifted from your phone."
Pretty plainly stated:
Main purpose - delete all data
A nice bonus - the process is semi hidden, no way to confirm mistakes or not
Purpose is NOT - Fool any attacker to think they have your phone even though it’s wiped
So it’s most definitely doing it’s job. You think that job is not enough, fair, but it’s living up to it’s own stated purposes.
Lol that’s just str8 false in this case, the stated purpose of the duress pin in the article is a system wipe, not plausible deniability.
So whoever has you under duress cannot steal your data
It’s not a ‘get out of duress free’-card
Empty apps or no apps aren’t necessarily a sign of guilt, but they will look at you like you are because its not normal.
Companies often have travel laptops which are a clean install and no private corporate info exposed.
I didn’t know android could do that. I wanna turn one on! But, I can’t find it. I’ve looked under Security and Privacy. I have a pattern to get in (they can physically force you to unlock your phone with fingerprints), no facial recognition, and my security and privacy is all green checkmarks. I’ve tried to find it under my Samsung account’s security stuff. Its not there. It doesn’t even show up when I search for it on the settings search bar. What am I missing?
I use Android 16 and have OneUI 8.5.
This is a GrapheneOS feature.
Oh, so its a different operating system or something?
You may be able to install GrapheneOS on your phone.
I installed it on my Google Pixel, and I have no intention of going back to stock Android.
Yes, it’s a different Android based OS. It’s privacy focused, hence having this feature, and only supports Google Pixel devices.
Android is just a version of Linux, so anyone can make a fork of it. Most Android device manufacturers do this, including your device having Samsung’s rendition of Android and my OnePlus having OxygenOS (soon to be ColorOS), but anyone can do the same if they’d like. LineageOS is another super cool Android project.
GrapheneOS is a custom fork(? Correct me if I’m wrong) of Android that retains most of the features but has a private and de-googled experience.
Without a warrant, it’s literally his phone to do with it what he pleases. Baffled that that’s not the end of the conversation.
Assuming we lived in a rational world with a fair and impartial justice system, and not one that exists to funnel money from the working class into the Epstein class and kill or imprison everyone that makes that less easy.
Another day closer to Chiron.
Oh, because they are outside US borders they claim not to need a warrant, but that doesn’t stop them using US law to prosecute him though.
I think the supreme court has said they can search phones without warrants at the border and points of entry, so airports.
You can’t be compelled to give them your password, but you can be compelled to use your biometric ID. Clear as mud.
With GrapheneOS you can enable the setting that requires you to use biometric identification to get to the passcode screen, which means you’re always protected by both.
https://www.cbp.gov/travel/cbp-search-authority/border-search-electronic-devices
You’ll be surprised by what you don’t know.
well they have the “border search exception” so at the border, no, they generally do not need a warrant for “routine searches” of electronic devices. Fucked up, but that is the law on the books and US courts have virtually always upheld it when it comes up.
Assuming we lived in a rational world with a fair and impartial justice system
That’s like assuming unicorns will protect all that is good and sugar is effective weight loss
Well yeah. Hence the second half of that sentence.
What’s a warrant?
A judge issues a warrant when there is an active criminal investigation. If there’s no investigation, no warrant.
Oh, that’s not how it works in the united States. Is this some commonwealth legal thing?
It is how it works inside the united states. It’s just they claim that because he was on the flight side of the airport, he wasn’t inside the US.
it is how it works
Thanks but I live here and it’s not basically ever.
Cops either use a pretense tools like a drug dog to establish probable cause for the search they want or do parallel construction after they’ve already built the general structure of a case, usually tracing things to a valid cause for search, usually via coached informant.
Or its ice and they can just do whatever they want.
You’re living in a fantasy world and your delusional ignorance is real danger is worrying. Please never approach or speak to me in person.
Did you stop reading at that point?
That’s not how it works. I’m not sure that’s how it’s ever worked. You’re living in a fantasy. Warrants are not a meaningfully real thing.
This is fucking stupid. If I delete something on my phone while I’m on vacation am I going to prison because the border patrol might have wanted to look at it?
Should have been born a child fucking billionaire if you don’t want to be sentenced to prison for 30 years.
I always forget that “choose better parents” one weird trick. ;-)
It’s like pulling yourself up by the bootstraps. So obvious. Just because it is impossible to do is no excuse.
What color are you and how far left are your politics?
It’s bullshit but with the current laws. Back up your phone before you head home wipe it before going through border control, and restore your backup when you get home.
That’s what I do but evidently that pisses them off
“It’s SOP for my business. The risk of phones getting lost or stolen at or near airports is high.”
This is great advice thank you
Their mood isn’t your responsibility. Carrying a blank phone is perfectly legal.
isn’tshouldn’t be*Their mood is a major determining factor in their target’s ability to stay out of prison.
Due process is dead.
That’s not really how the law works. You’re not making a comparable analogy. You sitting at home or in a hotel room is legally not remotely the same as when you’re being actively searched by a federal agent.
This is more like if the a police officer is about to do a pat-down search of someone, and they reach into their pocket, grab something, and rapidly swallow it.
You can destroy your property in normal circumstances whenever you please. If you delete a file in the privacy of your own home, odds are you’re not doing so for the purposes of evading law enforcement. However, if you do it literally seconds before law enforcement is about to get a hold of it, it’s pretty unambiguous that you’re trying to destroy evidence.
That’s the crucial difference here legally. Plausible deniability does not exist when you’re destroying something because a police search is imminent.
Yep. Backup and wipe before you get to the airport.
Or maybe you just don’t want some cop to see your dick pics. If they had anything on this dude they wouldn’t have needed to go through his phone.
I am explaining how the law works and the assumptions behind it. The law assumes that if you were embarrassed about your dick pics, that you would delete those before the officer is right about to search you.
The laws assumptions are bullshit.
This guy has no fucking idea how the law works. Destruction of evidence requires a primary crime, the one you’re destroying the evidence for. There is no crime, therefore no destruction of evidence. Only an incompetent or corrupt judge would let this even go to trial.
Only an incompetent or corrupt judge would let this even go to trial.
Like just about every judge appointed by Trump.
deleted by creator
Nah, they just lube up the rubber gloves and fist you, checking in case there’s a micro SD stashed up there. You should still make your flight if you relax.
And thats why you dont travel to countries with ropey regimes
We don’t need hyperbole here …. If authorities have a legal reason to search and you interfere with that, destruction of evidence is a crime. Delete all you want …. Right up until authorities claim the legal reason to search. Usually that takes a warrant: investigators must convince a judge there is a good reason
This also includes “when entering the country”. It always has. There’s nothing new here. There are so many things the current administration does to violate rights and due process, but this isn’t one of them.
The slippery slope here is “or within 100 miles”, but that wasn’t a factor here either
This also includes “when entering the country”. It always has. There’s nothing new here. There are so many things the current administration does to violate rights and due process, but this isn’t one of them.
Have to disagree with that one. Simply entering a country is not justification for searching someones phone. I don’t care what the law says. People have a right to privacy.
That’s how it should be. But that’s not what the law says.
I don’t care what the law says. People have a right to privacy.
Not since 2001 they don’t.
They do, just because the government says otherwise doesn’t make it true.
Yes, it does. Thats what governance means.
I’m not saying I agree with it, just that it’s always been so
There are so many things the current administration does to violate rights and due process, but this isn’t one of them.
You literally said they are not violating rights by doing this.
He’s saying that right was taken away by George W Bush.
Governments cannot take rights away. They can only infringe upon them. They are rights. Not privileges.
Then clearly you’re talking about deontological rights and they’re talking about legal rights and both wasting your breath
as far as I understand, they were not there to serve a warrant. he was crossing a border and the feds are claiming that the 4th amendment doesn’t apply because he hadn’t yet crossed into America.
border patrol was essentially using a loophole to preemptively collect potential evidence (they’ll figure out what to charge him with after they see his phone contents). he’s a political activist against a cop city, they were obviously trying to do him dirty.
they were not serving a search warrant. they were abusing what should be an illegal search at the border in order to silence those who speak out against govt overreach.
Finally a sensible reply. Quite a few NAZI bootlickers here. They’re the first the sign up it seems.
So the important takeaway is to delete your phone before customs. Presumably you have an encrypted backup you can restore without too much effort
If he wasnt in the US how can the US claim he violated a US law?
Are we reading the same article?
The incident took place at Atlanta’s Hartsfield-Jackson airport in January 2025
The US claims jurisdiction over its citizens wherever they are.
Which isn’t necessarily a bad thing, because it means you can be prosecuted in the US for stuff like going to Thailand and sexually abusing children there.
So the law applies, but protection under the law does not.
Isn’t all law essentially derived from powers granted by the constitution?
If the powers granted by it to enforce a law are applicable when not within the US then then it very reasonably ought to apply to any and all amendments.
But, reason is on the extinction list with the magafascists. (And all LEO)
In addition, the law that he’s charged with relates to knowingly destroying property that the police have a warrant to sieze.
There is no precedent of it being applied to border searches where they may not even have reasonable suspicion of a crime and can stop people for questioning on a whim.
The State has absolutely no claim over your personal property at that point and destroying property that the police hope and dream of siezing isn’t the same as destroying property where they’ve demonstrated probable cause to a judge.
This argument from the border patrol that you can be arrested for destroying data that is in your possession without ever been given due process and 4th amendment protections isn’t supported by precedence.
These fucking conservatives crawl out of the woodwork like cockroaches anytime the government does something heinous and use their piss poor understanding of EVERYTHING to try to justify the heinous actions. It happens every time, and I wish just once to see one of them use real and relevant facts, just so I can pretend that these people live in reality for just one second.
Hasn’t happened yet though.
Everything is a conspiracy theory when you don’t understand how anything works.
Good to know thanks
- get a phone with a removable battery and wireless charging
- break the USB port
- pull out the battery before crossing the border
sorry, my phone is dead and won’t hold a charge.
- nothing untrue about that statement
- state of the phone was a preexisting condition and cannot be used to apply obstruction charges
I mean, sure, but then they seize the phone and still get all the data. In this case he wiped the data so it couldn’t be seized.
The data would still be encrypted. Sure, they could try to brute-force the key but it is very unlikely they try that on some rando’s phone.
