I believe the joke is that Nintendo are aggressively litigious.

it’s the future

No doubt about that. It’s been “the future” for more than a decade. But even 5 years ago, Wayland was a complete dumpster fire if you strayed outside average use. So yeah, I’ve heard this before.

Of course, I had to turn that protection off because Steam is still X and my controllers back paddles popped up a permission dialog

I understand that this is a real sticking point with some use cases, I hope this is resolved soon. I’m definitely fuzzy on the workings of portals, compositors, input, etc.

Am I doing a good job convincing you?

This is the overwhelming response to my questions about Wayland, and it’s weird. Wayland isn’t a fancy new car I need to use to stay relevant. I work in terminals and a browser, Xfce is fine.

As I mentioned in another response, I am not trying to use the newest coolest thing, I work every day in Linux and I need my setup to be stable and predictable.

And no one needs to convince me, when xfce is finally discontinued or unusable, I’ll have to find a similar Wayland alternative. Nothing compels me to switch yet.

I am not trying to suggest that the old way is better, we have needed to move on from x11 years ago.

That is a good point, fair enough. I don’t really need this, so it doesn’t cross my radar.

Thanks for the response!

it’s hard to imagine needing to explain why Wayland has been better

I don’t really understand what you mean here, sounds like you’re describing a vibe, but that’s valid.

I have a multi-monitor setup with xfce and while it’s nothing to write home about, it works. Of course, I don’t need HDR. I guess my use case isn’t very demanding that way.

I have a wayland/gnome tablet because touchscreen, and I don’t see an appreciable difference in startup time, bit I have no empirical data on this.

I appreciate your response.

I am happy that keyboard and other I/o are being treated as separate from a security perspective.

Xorg fans

I am not as impressed by this comment snippet.

I am not a “fan” of xorg, and you should absolutely stop looking at it this way. This isn’t a matter of having a favourite car manufacturer. I am not commenting to convince everyone that xorg is “better”.

I simply use xorg. I have work to do, I use Linux to do it. My most stable and predictable configuration is using xfce, it just stays out of the way. I don’t care about ricing. I don’t GAF about GPU accelerated terminal emulators, especially when they bonk trying to connect to Solaris tty. I don’t care about HDR. If you do care about these things, that’s great, I’m not trying to diminish that.

I have been using Linux for almost 30 years, professionally for almost 25. I have been through Mir. I have somehow made it through alsa transition to pulseaudio, which sucked. I have been through Unity, the ffmpeg debacle, systemd, ndis wrappers, netplan, etc. Some of these new tooling options are better than previous ones, some aren’t. They effectively get the job done, and that’s the bottom line.

Never in my Linux experience have I seen such a sudden push to not only move everyone to new tooling, but to cast everyone using the old tools as somehow “refusing to move on”, especially in the last 2 or 3 years.

There will come a time when you will see your current tooling will be left behind and you’ll be in my situation. Have some grace about it.

And stop calling me an xorg “fan”.

and with more features.

Look, if you’re gonna tell x11 folks to provide examples of how Wayland is not meeting their needs, you need to meet the same bar and give a few examples of what these features are.

This is honestly what is holding me back from going all in on wayland… I don’t see any benefit.

Typically this is achieved in x11 with x forwarding. Performance won’t be great.

However: you may want to investigate using a hypervisor and a VM for each seat, and a dedicated GPU for each seat. To share GPU between seats, you will need a GPU and motherboard that support sr-iov, which is hard to find, hard to use, and expensive.

I built a hyper-converged box like this and I can tell you the GPU isn’t the obstacle, it’s peripherals. Mice, keyboard, video output, that is what people want to be flexible.

Last shows how long the last user logged in has been logged in. So if your system routinely has multiple users logged in, this may not be a useful metric.

Proxmox

• based on KVM
• relatively easy to install
• big community and lots of how-to guides
• well-documented hardware pass through
• minimal install (no cups, no extraneous software)